Hardware:
Problem to watch HD channels

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    • CommentAuthorperahl
    • CommentTimeNov 15th 2008 edited
     
    Hi

    Have since a week ago problems to watch Silver HD and TV4 HD but not for The History channel. I can watch the channels but with big disturbance. Have the same problem when I watch the channels at new transponder 12128 H and the old 12130 H. According to Telenors latest channellist the frequency is for these tree HD-channels 12128 H. I heard from someome that the parabol/LNB should be adjusted, but I have adjusted again and tested with instrument with the same negative result. My BER value is 30 on these channels and signal level is about 90%. Have tested with different CAM as Technicrypt and others but still the same problem. Why do I get these problems? Has it to do with the new Thor 5 because HD channels was moved from Thor 3? Is the Lyngbox something wrong with and for examle the MPEG-4 chip or weak DVB-S2 tuner? Anyone who has any idea and maybye had the same problem? I have another reciever Humax ICORD HD who is connected to the same parabol and there I dosent have the same problem. All HD channels from CD is perfect on Humax ICORD HD.

    Perahl
    • CommentAuthorPeter
    • CommentTimeNov 16th 2008 edited
     
    Hi perahl!

    The transponder BSS22 on Thor 5 at 0.8°west (frequency 12,128 GHz Horizontal polarisation, symbolrate: 30 000 Sym/s, forward error correction: 3/4) is very powerful in Sweden, about 52 dBW, so a small 70 cm dish is big enough for stable reception. What is very important for getting a "clean" signal is to set skew properly and to use a LNB with high cross polar isolation.
    Setting the correct "skew" could be done by tilting the whole dish or by rotating the LNB.
    You can use the satlex calculator if you don´t know the "skew" settings for Thor 5 at 0.8°west, se link below.

    http://www.satlex.de/en/azel_calc.html

    The settings of the dish/LNB are the same for Thor 3/5 since they´re in the same satellite position.
    Normally you should definetly have stabel reception with a BER-value which is as low as 30, so it might also be some problem with your LyngBox. I have a BER-value of 0 on this transponder using my toroidal dish T90, but I have no Canal digital-card so I can´t watch the encrypted TV-channels.
    Maby it´s the high symbolrate, 30 000 Sym/s, that´s causing the LyngBox problems, or maby it´s a CAM-problem ?

    /Peter
    • CommentAuthorperahl
    • CommentTimeNov 16th 2008 edited
     
    Hi Peter

    Thanks for good advices. I`m still wondering why my Humax ICORD HD is handeling this HD-channel problem correct and not LB. Different box and better tuner and MPEG-4 chip is the answer. I`m not shure about my Europa parabol T90, high isolation Triax Disec switch with 4 pcs of MTI High Gain Line LNB AK54-XT2N (Quad head). These heads have high cross polar isolation according to spec. Have you heard any negative comment about this high gain head? On 12128 H is now tree HD channels from CD and The History Channel there has also high symbol rate of 30000 sym/s and BER:30, has no problem. My problem to watch is för TV4 HD and Silver HD. Isn`t this very strange? My BER value of 20-30 is only for these channels. The others SD channels from CD have nearly all of them about BER:0. I m wondering why not more users of LB have the same problem? So I must consider if I should once again try to adjust my parabol or send my LB to the service company in Kalmar.

    Perahl
    • CommentAuthorAndersson
    • CommentTimeNov 16th 2008
     
    I have the same problem with TV4 HD and Silver HD
    • CommentAuthorperahl
    • CommentTimeNov 16th 2008 edited
     
    Hi

    If you are sure that your dish and LNB is ok then I think the Lyngbox MPEG-4 chip is something wrong with or SW. The problem has to do with high symbol rate of 30000 as "Peter" explained. Is also your History channel HD ok about watching quality? What BER value do you have on these problem HD-channels? I think all of LB owners who has Canal Digital and HD channels have perhaps the same problem. Hopefully Lyngbox Media solve this problem with a firmware update or must do something with the box. All owners who have this problem should join this forum with comments or contact Lyngbox Media support.

    Perahl
    • CommentAuthorPeter
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2008 edited
     
    perahl,

    Your LNB:s , MTI AK54-XT2N, are very good but should be used carefully because the high gain 67-70 dB might be too high if used together with short coaxial cabels on powerfull transponders like Thor 3/5 which might give an input signal that´s higher than the specified maximal input-level of the satellitereceiever. If that´s the case the signal will be distorted in the receiver which cause receptionproblems. The bigger dish you use the more important it is to think of not using a LNB with to much gain. A gain of about 55-60 dB is more suitable on a toroidal T90 dish for powerful transponders. On weak transponders or far out on the flanks of the toroidal dish a high gain LNB can be used, I´ve tested MTI AP8-T2NRC which have the same gain as your LNB:s and it works fine on the flanks of the dish where the gain of the dish gets very poor and the risk for overgained signal is reduced.
    I´ve placed my Thor 3/5 LNB (0,8°W) 14.3° from the centeral position (13,5°E) of the toroidal dish and I have no problem getting a BER value of "0" (100 % signalquality, 85-90 % signalstrength) and I use and old Digistar SF-1 LNB (NF:0,5 dB) and I think the gain in it is about 55 dB. What´s the central satellite position of your toroidal dish?
    Using high gain LNB:s might also cause problems with the isolation between the input-ports on DiSeqC-switches. But as long as you don´t get >100 % signal strength in the receiver the signal shouldn´t be overgained if the measurement in the receiver is calibrated correctly according to the maximal input-level of the receiver.
    Strange that you have only problem with TV4 HD and Silver HD and no problems with History Channel HD. What about TV Norge HD on the same transponder ?

    I still think you might be able to improve your signalquality if you adjust skew on your LNB by rotating it slightly, 8PSK-transmissions are extremly sensitive to the skew-setting compared to QPSK-transmissions. Also make sure you have the optimal focal-distance between the LNB/feedhorn and subreflektor.

    Unfortunately I have no CAM or canaldigital-card so I can´t test if I have the same problems.

    Do you know that Silver HD will change frequency again, se link below.

    http://www.telenorsbc.com/upload/Thor6/Silver%20HD%20move_031108_V2.pdf

    / Peter
    • CommentAuthorperahl
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2008 edited
     
    Peter

    I `ve put my Thor LNB nearly as you put yours as I remember. With the instrument Satlook NIT Colour I adjust all of the LNB for best signal. The hole dish have been adjusted according to the instrument aspecially about skew and other important parameters. About my high gain LNB so is the reason why I must have these because of very long cables. The cables is about 40 m. I have four LNB, LNB 1= Astra 28, LNB 2= Hotbird 13, LNB 3= Sirius and LNB 4= Thor 3/5. This is the reason why I chose high gain LNB instead of amplifier for each LNB. Still I dont know why Humax ICORD HD handle this problem better. My guess is that LB have problem with symbol rate of 30000.

    Perahl
    • CommentAuthorAndersson
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2008
     
    It is a CAM problems, has now tested a Techisat CA-modul then disappeared problem of image
    • CommentAuthorperahl
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2008 edited
     
    Hi

    Which Cam module do you mean? I use the CAM module that Lyngbox Media recommend which is Technicrypt CX and I have tested 4 other brands and get the same problem. Havent heard any answer yet from Lyngbox Media Support about this problem. I`m still waiting.

    Perahl
    • CommentAuthorperahl
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2008 edited
     
    Hi again

    I have tested again the TV channels Silver HD and TV4 HD and now they are ok without any wathing problem. Mayby something has been changed with transmissions values about transponder from Telenor and Thor 5 etc or something has to do with the weathersituation. All HD channels have no problem so far from Canal Digital . I wait and see if somehing will be changed. So far I have`nt done anything about CAM module or adjustment of dish and LNB since yesterday.

    Perahl
    • CommentAuthorAndersson
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2008
     
    Jag tar det på svenska ;)
    Jag har också testat mina ca-moduler och alla går att använda idag
    Men jag såg att det är en skillnad bithastigheten som man ser vid videoformat i ”kanalinfo”
    ligger stilla på ett värde vilket det inte gjorde tidigare på TV4 HD och Silver.
    History Channel har hela tiden visat ett fast värde.
    • CommentAuthorperahl
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2008 edited
     
    Hi

    I have noticed the same about transmission variation value (Mbits/s) for Silver HD and TV4 HD. Now we can only wait and see if its stabile for these HD-channels. I`ts strange that my second HD-box Humax ICORD HD worked perfect all the time without any problem. Something is different about Lyngbox compered with Humax ICORD HD.

    Perahl
    • CommentAuthorVANGELIS
    • CommentTimeDec 24th 2008
     
    Peter lyngbox is not a machine is a toy, we lost our money it is okay a dreambox is better to escape for this hi end machine with no functions.lyngbox media is rich now and celebrate the christmas and all of us cry why dont work this dont work the other.
    I tryed to put 11 lnbs with a wave frontier 3 days now 2 technicians and cry all together, with a dreambox and technomate work ok so, dont worry change the receiver like i do and everything back to normal.technology is to help people not to send us to doctors , who is lyngbox media to sell us this packet with nothing;merry chistmas for everyone
    • CommentAuthorPeter
    • CommentTimeDec 27th 2008
     
    Today I was going through the TV-channels on the satellite Eurobird 9 at 9.0°E and when I whatched "FTV HD" on the frequency 11,919 GHz vertical polarization (27500, 3/4) I discovered problems with jerkey movements in the picture, it´s seems that the LyngBox have problems to handle this HD-channel. I have good signalquality so it´s not a problem with the reception.

    / Peter

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